Solo Disappearance - Now RECOVERED

[ChrisM101]

Ok so the diagnosis is what? Flying into a tree blos? It had control until impact. After that what do we expect?

 

[Jason C]

Jason, regarding RxErrors, I just found out from one of the developers that RxErrors does not having anything to do with controller to receiver, it is for the telemetry data only. Same analysis as above, but different system. Has nothing to do with the ability to control flight.

Curious as to what developers you are talking to.

If rxerrors relates to telemetry data, how is that not relevant in a drone that requires telemetry data to fly correctly?

 

[ChrisM101]

That data is healthy in your drone. That's just the message to display on the controller.

 

[Jason C]

That data is healthy in your drone. That's just the message to display on the controller.

I don't follow?

 

[ChrisM101]

I don't follow?

That data is always healthy within the solo itself. You're seeing a drop in the transmit of the data that is being shown on your screen. Don't confuse sensor data with telemetry data. Telemetry data is a mirror image of sensor data that you are viewing remotely.

 

[ChrisM101]

If you read battery voltage with a meter on solo then write it on paper and hand it to someone else to see. That's telemetry it has zero effect on solo whether you wrote it down wrong and it was sloppy or a decimal in the wrong spot.

If a sensor on solo reads voltage wrong and sends it thru solo and solo adjusts then there is a problem. But the error u see is just the quality of the note to you to view.

 

[Jason C]

If you read battery voltage with a meter on solo then write it on paper and hand it to someone else to see. That's telemetry it has zero effect on solo whether you wrote it down wrong and it was sloppy or a decimal in the wrong spot.

But isn't communication from the drone to the receiver bidirectional?

 

[ChrisM101]

But isn't communication from the drone to the receiver bidirectional?

Not exactly Control goes out and telemetry comes back.

 

[Jason C]

Not exactly Control goes out and telemetry comes back.

Ok, but if something is keeping the controller from getting data from the drone (or causing errors) doesn't it stand to reason that same thing would keep the drone from getting data from the controller (or causing errors)?

 

[ChrisM101]

Ok, but if something is keeping the controller from getting data from the drone (or causing errors) doesn't it stand to reason that same thing would keep the drone from getting data from the controller (or causing errors)?

Control data is rapidly and repeatedly updated. Think of it as frames per second. If it's 60 frames per second and 30 are good you had the same command issued 30 times correctly and the others are dropped as the data is not wrong but it just doesn't make a command.besides it already has 30 good frames of command.

Problems occur when you have seconds with no commands passed. Then it says I need to do this myself.

 

[Jason C]

Control data is rapidly and repeatedly updated. Think of it as frames per second. If it's 60 frames per second and 30 are good you had the same command issued 30 times correctly and the others are dropped as the data is not wrong but it just doesn't make a command.besides it already has 30 good frames of command.

Ok, but what's the threshold? An example of 60 frames vs 30 frames is fine, but what is the number that actually results in an issue, even if for a moment?

It seems too coincidental that the moments where the drone passes right in front of the tower signals you point out that the rxerrors jump up, yet somehow in no way affects anything else. Especially given that I was actually there at the time and witnessed what happened. You don't have to believe me, I really don't care about that, but *I* know what the drone was doing and ending up where it did, when it did, and the speed it was going was not reacting as expected.

 

[ChrisM101]

Solo is Vertically polarized. The antennas go up and down the legs. When you hit something and turn on its side they are horizontal. Thus polarization mismatch is 3dbi loss. As soon as they go horizontal you lose half of your signal strength. Every 3dbi gain is twice as much. Every 3dbi loss is making it half as much as before.
Turning on side loses half your range and control in its current state and cannot be avoided. It's science.

 

[Jason C]

Solo is Vertically polarized. The antennas go up and down the legs. When you hit something and turn on its side they are horizontal. Thus polarization mismatch is 3dbi loss. As soon as they go horizontal you lose half of your signal strength. Every 3dbi gain is twice as much. Every 3dbi loss is making it half as much as before.
Turning on side loses half your range and control in its current state and cannot be avoided. It's science.

Sorry, what's the point here? What I'm referring to is all BEFORE the hit.

 

[ChrisM101]

Ok, but what's the threshold? An example of 60 frames vs 30 frames is fine, but what is the number that actually results in an issue, even if for a moment?

It seems too coincidental that the moments where the drone passes right in front of the tower signals you point out that the rxerrors jump up, yet somehow in no way affects anything else. Especially given that I was actually there at the time and witnessed what happened. You don't have to believe me, I really don't care about that, but *I* know what the drone was doing and ending up where it did, when it did, and the speed it was going was not reacting as expected.

It very well could have an effect. But you have to show it in the data you have. Unfortunately it may have affected your fpv long enough to allow you to fly into the tree.

Video is very complex and lots of data it's taking most of the signal. Control needs little so if you effect video it's near real time and visible to you. Control is not so much.

Video drops or freezes when a few frames fail Control stops when no frames pass or the data is passed invalid.

 

[rrmccabe]

Solo is Vertically polarized. The antennas go up and down the legs. When you hit something and turn on its side they are horizontal. Thus polarization mismatch is 3dbi loss. As soon as they go horizontal you lose half of your signal strength. Every 3dbi gain is twice as much. Every 3dbi loss is making it half as much as before.
Turning on side loses half your range and control in its current state and cannot be avoided. It's science.

This is true but really 3db is not double or half your range. 3db gain is like doubling your power but definitely does not equate to double range. If you guys are still talking about his mishap he was close enough it did not matter anyway.

 

[ChrisM101]

This is true but really 3db is not double or half your range. 3db gain is like doubling your power but definitely does not equate to double range. If you guys are still talking about his mishap he was close enough it did not matter anyway.

Well BLOS a loss of half power can effect it. Just rotating in place effects it.
He has to prove in the data that he gave one input in control and solo did something different. I had to prove this to get my RMA. I showed them a video of solo going back and right while matching it to.the data showing my inputs of forward.

 

[ChrisM101]

When it went horizontal he lost video and Control because of polarization mismatch.

Why was it so weak to begin? Who knows?

The Telcom lines under the bridge, and yagi antennas on the water level sensors cannot help

 

[Flying Squirrel]

I'd call it weird before dumb ... I recently reported some GPS glitches and very poor transmitter performance ... Five minutes to get a GPS lock and I was getting 600 - 900 feet before connection lose an RTH.

Yesterday I put Solo on the ground, turned around, and Solo immediately told me to FLY Sunspots? ... Well away we went! I flew out and back 1500+ feet at 200-300 AGL in every direction. The ONLY difference in setup was I had my antenna oriented straight up. At a distance of 1500 feet I could not see Solo and I was still getting great video.

Now RTH was a bit off ... Solo kept flying over my head, behind the flight line and attempting to land on car. Had to put a stop to that ...

I compare this to the early Garmin products where that witch kept telling me to turn and could not differentiate between the interstate and a parallel side street. Maybe 3DR hired Ms Garmin after she got canned?

 

[Jubalr]

Sorry, what's the point here? What I'm referring to is all BEFORE the hit.

Apparently what I have found for you is not what you want to hear and for that I apologize. Your Rx errors were normal through out the flight (I have compared several logs). RxError has only to do with the telemetry data(bat voltage, current, etc..) that is displayed on your screen and 0 to do with control of the Solo. Signal and GPS was good up to the point of contact, at which point it could have even broke a blade or two but didn't matter since it was stuck in a tree and laying on it's side. Your control inputs were received and answered (see Ian's post). GPS was strong, satellite count was high and control signal was good. Unfortunately, you drifted just close enough to a tree higher than 40' (40.1 is enough) and got stuck. You don't fly RC long without incidents and there is a saying in RC older than you are; "RC=Build, Fly, Crash, Repeat" and applies equally to us as it does the military.

Take Care and Fly Safe..
Jubal

 

[Proficnc]

Hi Jason,
I have reviewed this crash as well, the Solo did exactly as it was instructed, right up till the point of impact. I hope for your sake that it is still in the tree.

There was nothing wrong with any signal on your Solo, the logs are clear on that.

My suggestion, PM me, and I can give you some advice on getting airborne again...