Solo crash, looking for help understanding tlog file

[Crisp Rice]

Hi All

This is a sad day for me, because I did a lot of research before buying a drone, I chose 3DR because they were apparently taking responsibility for any issues that came about due to software or hardware issues. In my case they have a loophole they can exploit, insomuch as I took off and landed on a dock, so they are giving me the brush off.

This time Manuel is telling me a "motor went down" (see below) does anyone understand what this means and why it is my fault?

And I will state as a categorical fact that I landed the drone exactly where it took off from.

Presumably their final response. Which amusingly enough ends with "have a great day" as follows:


Manuel (3DR)

Sep 5, 4:49 PM PDT

Hello Christopher,

The Roll input can be seen in the image attached to the email called "Roll input", you can see that right when the motor went down, the Roll input was given and as explained before, it can cause a landing issue.
You mentioned the compass, variance, nevertheless, the Solo didn't land in the same position where it took off from (See image "Location" attached); taking this into account, plus the fact that the landing location is not a normal place to land Solo, the issue can be caused by the environment itself where the Solo was flown and landed.
Any metal or electronics near the Solo can make the compass in the leg #4 to react to it, even when the Solo was affected by the environment, it didn't show any dramatic difference in the heading.

You can find in our online page when the Solo is covered by the warranty, it clearly explains that we can only authorize a replacement if the Solo was damaged by a hardware malfunction under normal consumer usage; the place where the Solo took off and landed is not a recommended place, you can find this in our manual and support articles.
[Hardware Warranty | 3DR - Drone & UAV Technology]

Let me know if you have any other question.

Have a great day.

Best regards,
Manuel Mora
[3DR Technical Support Engineer]

 

[Crisp Rice]

Looks like I have some stuff to sell... My experience tells me that two rebuttals means that it will be even harder to convince someone to reverse their opinion. Sad for me as I was enjoying my Solo.

Be warned, it does look like 3DR has used a loophole to escape responsibility for a failure based on my take off location and has refused to comment on obviously documented software/hardware errors.

Here is my (admittedly dramatic) response to Manueal at 3DR


Hi Manuel

I understand that 3DR have an easy way out of taking responsibility for this problem insomuch as I took off from a dock. And therefore 3DR can simply say "this is not in our recommended practices and therefore not covered". Fine.

You reference in your email below "when the motor went down" - are you saying a motor failed on my Solo? Is that what "went down" means? Or if this a language translation issue between you and I?

Regardless, I was there when the crash happened, and while you have no obligation to believe me, you are simply incorrect as to the circumstances. I took off from precisely the same location that I landed, to within 2 or 3 feet, which is closer than most of my take offs and landings. And I was not aware that landing in the same place as taking off was required, and therefore lI am unsure as to why this is part of your rebuttal.

I suspect that most of your customers would appreciate an honest response which would be "sorry, you took off from a boat/dock and therefore it's not our problem". End of story.

Simply put, your company is about to lose my business and also about to ensure that I publicize this disappointing situation as much as I can.

I would like the answer to one last question - did anyone else in your organization have any input in this matter? Or is this on your shoulders alone?

Let me know if you have any other questions.

Have a great day.

Chris

 

[SARDG]

...Let me know if you have any other questions.

Have a great day.

Chris

LMAO

What was that Image he referred to - the satellite image of the dock?

So, it seems that you can take off from land and crash into the water and Solo is, (or may be) covered. Taking off from a dock (or presumably, a boat) and crashing into the water - not covered. There was some discussion on these forums about moving Solo during arming. I think the bottom line was that it isn't recommended.

 

[Pedals2Paddles]

"The motor went down"... I believe he's saying the throttle output to that motor was reduced, causing it to lean and fly in that direction. He's saying that the flight controller commanding a movement in that direction matches the control stick input from you. In short, he's saying you flew it into the boat and it wasn't a malfunction. He's also saying the compass error did not cause any change in flight attitude, and is irrelevant. Can you post that image he's referring to?

 

[Crisp Rice]

Unfortunately I do think there have been some language issues here. I do not believe that Manel's first language is English. Here is his (presumably) final response:

Manuel (3DR)

Sep 6, 4:08 PM PDT

Hello Christopher,

The motors going down indicates that the Solo touched the ground while trying to land; when the Solo tries to lower, but the floor is in the way, it tries to lower itself, the motors even more, which is what the flight logs show.

Also, the flight logs were reviewed by my coworkers, nevertheless, we didn't find any hardware malfunction when the Solo flipped over.

Have a great day.

Best regards,
Manuel Mora
[3DR Technical Support Engineer]



[1R4V2O-2ER1]

 

[Crisp Rice]

And here is my final response:

Hi Manuel,

I have read your response and don't really think that you are answering my questions in a fair and honest manner. But I suspect that your company's current situation and its lack of interest in the future regarding the consumer market may be the reason.

Per your statement regarding the hardware errors I would have to ask: none of you see the EKF errors repeatedly and none of you see the Compass error that I and several others on the 3DRPilot forum can see? Seriously? Or I am I am being bamboozled with your repeated reference to "hardware" errors? Is this in fact a "Software" error? Because that is what I and several others have thought ... The version of software/firmware that I was running was causing these particular EKF and Compass problems. So yes, you may be correct, no hardware issues - but your software update in fact crashed my drone. I am reading other current cases where other Solos crashed in a similar manner despite being on hard land. I hope for their sakes that you give them a fair hearing, unlike me.

I understand that you have taken a stand and therefore I will not bother you henceforth. Be assured that I will publicize my opinion as and when I can. Having said that, I do believe that if your company was staying in the retail consumer market that your response would not have been the same.

Have a Great Day.

 

[SARDG]

Have a Great Day...

 

[Crisp Rice]

3DR's final response:

Manuel (3DR)

Sep 7, 3:18 PM PDT

Hello Christopher,

I'm really sorry that the analysis results weren't what you were expecting.

If you need assistance in the future please, don't hesitate to contact us.

Have a great day.

Best regards,
Manuel Mora
[3DR Technical Support Engineer]



[1R4V2O-2ER1]

 

[User Name]

3DR's final response:

I'm really sorry that the analysis results weren't what you were expecting.

I would still press them to explain the errors. I would say that, yes, the analysis isn't what you were expecting in that they've failed to explain the errors recorded in the log at all and focused only on the landing.

When I play though your log, the EKF and Compass Variance errors towards the end happen when you're still 2.6 meters/8.5 feet in the air. So these faults precede your landing.

Do you know exactly what firmware you were using?

For others, was the firmware that contained the critical bug that caused the through-the-window flyaway an official firmware, or was it part of the beta testing of 2.4?

If it was an official firmware, and that's what you were using, I would ask to have this issue escalated to a manager. There was a thread here, that I can't find anymore, that contained a screenshot of a message from someone at 3DR warning to update to the most recent firmware to resolve a critical issue that had caused the preceding few flyaways.

 

[Crisp Rice]

I don't know what the difference between the various packages are, this is what the iPad tells me:
View media item 405

 

[Crisp Rice]

Hi User,

I have sent them another email per your request, as follows. I don't think they will want to answer to your questions though, they are using the dock take off to excuse themselves of giving real answers. My email is as follows:

Hi Manuel

I have been keeping the folks on the 3DR pilots forum updated with this situation. These are people who are still customers of your company. One of them, who is clearly concerned, has asked me to follow up and ask for explanations to his concerns. I have simply linked his text from his post because he clearly understands this better than I. It follows below. He also believes that I should be demanding an escalation to your manager.

Here is his email:
"I would still press them to explain the errors. I would say that, yes, the analysis isn't what you were expecting in so much as they've failed to explain the errors recorded in the log at all and focused only on the landing.
When I play though your log, the EKF and Compass Variance errors towards the end happen when you're still 2.6 meters/8.5 feet in the air. So these faults precede your landing.

Do you know exactly what firmware you were using?
For others, was the firmware that contained the critical bug that caused the through-the-window flyaway an official firmware, or was it part of the beta testing of 2.4?
If it was an official firmware, and that's what you were using, I would ask to have this issue escalated to a manager. There was a thread here, that I can't find anymore, that contained a screenshot of a message from someone at 3DR warning to update to the most recent firmware to resolve a critical issue that had caused the preceding few flyaways."

Please would you respond to his points?

And on a final note, I would ask that you please do stop signing off your emails with "Have a great day". It has become insulting at this point, given the content of your emails.

Kind regards,

Chris

 

[Pedals2Paddles]

That firmware you have now is the one with the bug.

 

[Crisp Rice]

Hi Peddles

Presumably they know that from my logs that they received with the crash report. I guess they don't care.

Cheers!

Chris

 

[Crisp Rice]

I have removed the motors one at a time and fired up the solo. It will boot up now with one motor removed.

Any advice?

Thanks

Chris

 

[Pedals2Paddles]

Yes. Buy a new motor pod from Spektre (Home) for $40. A dead motor pod is the most common fault after a solo takes a bath. That's not to say there isn't anything else wrong that you haven't been able to diagnose yet. But $40 is better than $499.

 

[PdxSteve]

Sounds like a motor is burned out. Try taking the bad one that you removed and replacing it with it's counterpart. Like if it's a silver that doesn't work, swap it with the other silver and see if it still doesn't work. If it still doesn't, it's the motor and can be replaced. If it does, it's internal.

 

[Crisp Rice]

Switched #4 motor to #2 location and solo still boots up.

I tried to connect to the controller and can't get it to connect. I have tried to pair the solo following the reset procedure. No yellow light at all.

Additionally, the solo is determined to point straight down but it is working insomuch as it is pointing straight down as I tilt the drone. This may actually have been the last angle I was shooting though.

I suspect that the problems are multiple...

Thanks so much for the help too!

Chris

 

[Pedals2Paddles]

Sounds like you're screwed unfortunately.

 

[Crisp Rice]

Yup

In more ways than one

Trying to decide whether to find a replacement solo or cut my loses. I have the backpack, 3 batteries, controller.

 

[User Name]

Yup

In more ways than one

Trying to decide whether to find a replacement solo or cut my loses. I have the backpack, 3 batteries, controller.

Don't give up on getting 3DR to replace it. If you were using the firmware with the bug, and from what I understand, the bug had to do with EKF, and you had an EKF error just prior to the flyaway... it seems real hard for them to pin the whole thing on your landing.