Who has more issues? The Phantom 4 or SOLO

rsimcox · May 2, 2016

I have two 3DR models the Solo and the X8-M and just recently purchased the Phantom 4. I am currently using the Phantom 4 for mapping missions using the Maps Made Easy app running on iOS. With my X8 and Solo, I use Mission Planner to plan all my missions. The X8 is by far my favorite for mapping, I'm able to use the Canon SX260 camera providing me with the best images over the GoPro or Phantom cameras. Now this is not to say the the GoPro or Phantom cameras do not perform acceptable, just not at the same resolution as the SX260.
In regards to the Solo, I have had more issues with 3DR's customer service since they have started the offering of the new enterprise system. Prime example, I had two tickets entered with their service for almost two months now and no reply. IMO, 3DR's service to the little guy has gone down hill dramatically in the past couple of months. Still having connections issues with Solo and an android tablet, this is why I invested in a Windows laptop in order to use MP. I can connect via wifi to solo in order to save mission. The solo app has many problems running on an android device in my experience. I loved my Solo when I first purchased it, but with the app issues on android devices and no response from 3DR service to aid in resolving this issue my opinion has changed.
The Phantom 4 has performed flawlessly since I have purchased it and I have flown many mapping missions. The camera quality and control are better than the GoPro and equal to the Yuneec CGo3. I have the good fortune to have a nephew that works for the Outdoor channel as a video editor. I have sent him 4K video files from the modified GoPro Hero 4 Black, Yuneec and Phantom 4. From a resolution and control aspect the Phantom 4 video was the best in his opinion. The close second was the Yuneec video.
At this point and 4 drones later based upon operation and video quality, excluding service issues and based upon what I use my drone for, the X8 is for sure 1st place. I would place the Phantom 4 over the Solo at this point and my Yuneec Q500 before Solo.
Again in my experience to date, due to the lack of tech support I have received from 3DR on the Solo issues I have and the app problem when used on an android device, I would have to choose the Phantom 4 over Solo for image quality, operation and easy of use. I many eat my words tomorrow with my Phantom 4, but so far this platform has perform way above my expectations.

I just think that 3DR has turned their back on the Solo people that got them to the dance, unless you might have a direct line to insiders. The X8 though has performed perfectly since purchased and has hundreds of hours under its belt and has had no problems what so ever in performance. I love my X8-M and wish that 3DR had not discontinued this craft, by far one of the best mapping drones on the market IMO. So much better than Phantom 4 for sure.

jibcamera · May 3, 2016

I guess this is as good a thread as any to share some highlights of my first day/ 3 batteries worth of Solo flights / footage... I flew completely manual with stock setup, I did not balance props or motors , I installed my own gimbal (tight and stock hdmi cable wanted to sit on one of the gimbal dampeners, but I think I got it isolated before I closed it up).

Shot with Hero4 Black in 2.7K/60 Protune, Flat, sharpness low, no filters, stock lens
Post workflow: cam files directly into FCPX 1080/60 project, color graded, stabilization added to a few of the clips (mostly due to operator error/ excitement of first flights

), rendered 1080/60 in h264 and obviously youtubes recompression

Overall thoughts:

1. Gopro resolution is about what I expected (so I was prepared to be underwhelmed) - if anyone has any gopro tips, would love to hear...I feel like the stock lens is not really focused enough towards infinity, but I also shot alot of this at dusk and I realize thats a rough time of day for gopro sensor

2. I will be getting polarizer and ND filters soon, and most likely will swap lenses, also wil be getting FPVLR or ALFA antenna

3. Was pretty happy with Solo/gimbal performance flying in about 8 knot light coastal winds...I would like to see the gimbal tilt feather-rate be adjustable(slower is better) with the dial on the right front side of controller ( i know that dial controls speed for preprogrammed tilts, but I dont think it works in manual mode??)

4.Flight times were 16 minutes across all batteries, returning home with 10-15%...line of sight farthest distance flown was 5000ft in a pretty quiet area (but not too far from civilization)

no real rhyme or reason to this edit, just a proof of workflow trying to get best quality resolution out of gopro...peace

Bullflyer · May 3, 2016

I can see your video only in 480p, or lower resolution.
I don't know if other persons can see the video in HD

Rusty Jones · May 3, 2016

rsimcox said:
I have two 3DR models the Solo and the X8-M and just recently purchased the Phantom 4. I am currently using the Phantom 4 for mapping missions using the Maps Made Easy app running on iOS. With my X8 and Solo, I use Mission Planner to plan all my missions. The X8 is by far my favorite for mapping, I'm able to use the Canon SX260 camera providing me with the best images over the GoPro or Phantom cameras. Now this is not to say the the GoPro or Phantom cameras do not perform acceptable, just not at the same resolution as the SX260.
In regards to the Solo, I have had more issues with 3DR's customer service since they have started the offering of the new enterprise system. Prime example, I had two tickets entered with their service for almost two months now and no reply. IMO, 3DR's service to the little guy has gone down hill dramatically in the past couple of months. Still having connections issues with Solo and an android tablet, this is why I invested in a Windows laptop in order to use MP. I can connect via wifi to solo in order to save mission. The solo app has many problems running on an android device in my experience. I loved my Solo when I first purchased it, but with the app issues on android devices and no response from 3DR service to aid in resolving this issue my opinion has changed.
The Phantom 4 has performed flawlessly since I have purchased it and I have flown many mapping missions. The camera quality and control are better than the GoPro and equal to the Yuneec CGo3. I have the good fortune to have a nephew that works for the Outdoor channel as a video editor. I have sent him 4K video files from the modified GoPro Hero 4 Black, Yuneec and Phantom 4. From a resolution and control aspect the Phantom 4 video was the best in his opinion. The close second was the Yuneec video.
At this point and 4 drones later based upon operation and video quality, excluding service issues and based upon what I use my drone for, the X8 is for sure 1st place. I would place the Phantom 4 over the Solo at this point and my Yuneec Q500 before Solo.
Again in my experience to date, due to the lack of tech support I have received from 3DR on the Solo issues I have and the app problem when used on an android device, I would have to choose the Phantom 4 over Solo for image quality, operation and easy of use. I many eat my words tomorrow with my Phantom 4, but so far this platform has perform way above my expectations.

I just think that 3DR has turned their back on the Solo people that got them to the dance, unless you might have a direct line to insiders. The X8 though has performed perfectly since purchased and has hundreds of hours under its belt and has had no problems what so ever in performance. I love my X8-M and wish that 3DR had not discontinued this craft, by far one of the best mapping drones on the market IMO. So much better than Phantom 4 for sure.

What are the issues are you having (two tickets)? Hard to believe no reply, since I just e-mailed them about some logging questions last week, and had a reply in 24hrs, and follow ups with much shorter time frames (<2 hrs). I would try again, maybe the tickets got jumbled up during the changes??

I see you are having an issue with an Android tablet? Which tablet? Is this the reason for two help tickets? Maybe someone here can help. I am running a Galaxy Tab S2, with minimal issues. Biggest issue I have is when changing batteries. Some times the GoPro video doesn't come back. All I have to do is press the button on the tablet to see all the apps running, then pick the Solo app and the video comes right back. Are you fully up to date on firmware and apps, Solo firmware, 3DR Services app, and Solo app?

Glad to see the P4 is working for you, I know a quite a few are having issues with it holding altitude and battery cases cracking

Image quality: Granted that the wide lens of the GoPro is a turn off for some, there are many options now for narrower FOVs, with amazing image quality. And while the workflow for a P4 video and a H4Blk video (via Solo) might be slightly different, the final resulting videos should be compairable.

pyrate · May 3, 2016

for first pass looks pretty good.
It took me almost 8 months to get my settings, camera and post where I was finally happy with the video.
You do have to work a bit to make a gopro look great.
You will be much happier once you swap that lens out.

Rusty Jones · May 3, 2016

Just a quick comment, the GoPro lens is focused for close ups more than infinity. Better results can be had if the lens is refocused.

Bullflyer · May 3, 2016

pyrate said:
for first pass looks pretty good.
It took me almost 8 months to get my settings, camera and post where I was finally happy with the video.
You do have to work a bit to make a gopro look great.
You will be much happier once you swap that lens out.

Pyrate, could you see the video in HD ?

pyrate · May 3, 2016

Yes, you have to click the little gear and select you resolution
when a video is first posted it is only available in lower resolutions
it takes a while for the HD versions to process. if you looked at it right after posting 1080p may not have been an option

Bullflyer · May 3, 2016

pyrate said:
Yes, you have to click the little gear and select you resolution
when a video is first posted it is only available in lower resolutions
it takes a while for the HD versions to process. if you looked at it right after posting 1080p may not have been an option

I can see a lot of videos in HD on Youtube right now, but not this one ¿ ?

Rusty Jones · May 3, 2016

Just viewed in 720 (highest)

Thierry · May 3, 2016

When is comes to video quality, the GoPro won't ever beat the P3 and P4.

With a Phantom, all you need to do after the shoot is grade the shot.
They also have screw-on ND and polarized filters that screw on the camera, so no extra balancing is required.

With Solo and the GoPro, you'll need to remove lens distortion (with stock lens) and stabilize it before you can really use it. Both these processes will soften your image quite a bit (if you look at it at 1:1 ratio).
If you use 3rd party lenses, some pink corner grading might be needed.
And if you use filters, you'll need to counterbalance them.

All in all, it's more work to deal with GoPro footage than footage from a Phantom.
That's personally why I want a better camera on it. And 3DR has been bragging about the possibility to swap cameras but nobody has come up with one yet that cater the videographers.

jibcamera · May 3, 2016

Bullflyer said:
I can see your video only in 480p, or lower resolution.
I don't know if other persons can see the video in HD

hi, I have noticed that different browsers offer different resolutions... My PC running Firefox only shows me up to 720, but my Shield tablet running Android 6.x shows me 1080/60 as an option....and my cheapish android 5.x smartphone doesnt have a 720 capable screen, so i am never offered anything above 480 in youtube app, But on youtube in the browser i am offered 1080....confusing.. Thanks for checking it out...I forgot to add that i am happy with my purchase/choice of SOLO and eagerly await better camera options.

Rusty Jones · May 3, 2016

Thierry said:
When is comes to video quality, the GoPro won't ever beat the P3 and P4.

With a Phantom, all you need to do after the shoot is grade the shot.
They also have screw-on ND and polarized filters that screw on the camera, so no extra balancing is required.

With Solo and the GoPro, you'll need to remove lens distortion (with stock lens) and stabilize it before you can really use it. Both these processes will soften your image quite a bit (if you look at it at 1:1 ratio).
If you use 3rd party lenses, some pink corner grading might be needed.
And if you use filters, you'll need to counterbalance them.

All in all, it's more work to deal with GoPro footage than footage from a Phantom.
That's personally why I want a better camera on it. And 3DR has been bragging about the possibility to swap cameras but nobody has come up with one yet that cater the videographers.

Re: filters and balancing
Unless you have a filter that is somehow at the exact balance point of the camera/gimbal, adding any filter will change the balance point. Now whether or not the gimbal cares is a different matter.

pyrate · May 3, 2016

Thierry said:
When is comes to video quality, the GoPro won't ever beat the P3 and P4.

With a Phantom, all you need to do after the shoot is grade the shot.
They also have screw-on ND and polarized filters that screw on the camera, so no extra balancing is required.

With Solo and the GoPro, you'll need to remove lens distortion (with stock lens) and stabilize it before you can really use it. Both these processes will soften your image quite a bit (if you look at it at 1:1 ratio).
If you use 3rd party lenses, some pink corner grading might be needed.
And if you use filters, you'll need to counterbalance them.

All in all, it's more work to deal with GoPro footage than footage from a Phantom.
That's personally why I want a better camera on it. And 3DR has been bragging about the possibility to swap cameras but nobody has come up with one yet that cater the videographers.

I respectfully disagree.
there are plenty of pure crap videos coming out of both platforms and I have seen gopro footage that blows away anything shot on a P3 or P4
A camera is but a tool,. it is the artist and technician behind the shot that will determine results.
Have not seen a P3 used in professional shoots, there are plenty of examples of gopro footage in such movies and tv shots

Thierry · May 3, 2016

As far as I know, they the GoPro and Phantoms both use the same sensor so you should be able to get similar images out of it. I'm just saying that the post production and tinkering required it more cumbersome with Solo and a GoPro.

pyrate said:
Have not seen a P3 used in professional shoots, there are plenty of examples of gopro footage in such movies and tv shots

Say whut? There's a collossal amount of pro work done with Phantoms.

pyrate · May 3, 2016

the biggest issue with the gopro is fisheye, and you do not have to change the lens, but it helps tremendously
you just said no way you will ever get the same quality out of a gopro then in the next post make my point, they both have almost the exact same sensor
Wont argue it takes a bit of work, took 8 months to get mine dialed in, and would not trade it for anything now
My edit time is down to almost normal footage.

But there is absolutely nothing magical about P3 cameras, same sensor as you say. and you cant just take footage out of one and go pro with it. You will post process like any other camera

pyrate · May 3, 2016

OK correction, I would trade for a good M43

SPP · May 4, 2016

Those who are not familiar with GoPro's Protune capability for video will be suprised at its "power", if one eventually understand how to grade using protune in its native editor the freebie GoPro Studio, in Cineform format and then use the usual editor of choice which knows cineform codec...simultenously.

If one is a diver, underwater video color grading or correction with Protune is like "god sent" in camera factor so small n low cost.

Greg Parker · May 4, 2016

SPP said:
if one eventually understand how to grade using protune in its native editor the freebie GoPro Studio, in Cineform format and then use the usual editor of choice which knows cineform codec...simultenously.
.

Could you explain this thought a little better; not sure I understand what you are trying to say.

SPP · May 4, 2016

Hi Greg,

Try to read these.......

GoPro/CineForm Insider: Why I shoot Protune -- Always!

GoPro/CineForm Insider: Protune 2.0

GoPro CineForm codec support in Premiere Pro
GoPro CineForm intermediate codec support in Premiere Pro | Adobe Premiere Pro CC tutorials

Old info, but useful nevertheless
Protune vs. Cineform in Vegas -- the Tests : Vegas Pro Forum

Below is cineform.mov from GoPro Studio running parallel* with After Effect, start at 4:30

This one I never try , I am dumb on NLE use and only use the super easy Vegas Pro

GoPro LUTs Color Grading Pack by IWLTBAP

Cineform.mov from GoPro Studio can run parallel* with Vegas Pro too.
*Best to have two screens and both screen calibrated.

Here is a sample I am running parallel GoPro Studio and Vegas Pro, but the video is not
recorded in Protune, so I don't grade anything.

This one I mess color in GoPro Sudio and it will happen too in Vegas Pro.

Cineform avi or mov, no matter how much you mess with its color or contrast or whatever, it stays a virgin file as you only mess with its metadata.

If MP4 file, when u want to mess with color, true result can only be seen when already rendered and that make it a 2nd or 3rd copy. MP4 is a lossy codec. Cineform is "almost" lossless.

Protune is not for everybody. Cineform was bought out by GoPro when Hero2 was rigged to do 3-D video.
Because GoPro Studio is free, many people underestimated it. When Cineform was Cineform stand alone, you need to pay decent $$ to use it for as intermediate codec.

Info on Cineform, if you want to learn more of it....
GoPro's CineForm Codec Is Now an Industry Standard
Cineform - superior alternative to ProRes

Enjoy.........