High altitude flying solo

[Dobie Ardmore]

The air is simply too thing for this kind of configuration. If it lasted a minute with stock propellers, you might get a minute and a half out of master air screw props. You can't make something out of nothing. High altitude work like that requires low kv motors turning big ass high pitch props. You're not going to get that with a solo.

Not to bust your chops here, but......nothing you stated is true. "if it lasted a minute.." a minute ????? Your time and comparison make no sense whatsoever. A 50% increase in time????

Guys are reporting a mere 5% increase in flight times with MAS props

In any event, mathematics and engineering discussion aside, (which will also confirm these results) let's talk real world examples OF ALTITUDE.

Apparently, someone has flown a DJI Phantom 3 to a height of 20,000 feet! This is in STOCK configuration.
The DJI runs a fairly fast motor at 800kv or 920-960kv (Solo being 880kv)
Additionally, DJI props are SMALLER in diameter than Solo with a similar pitch.

There are plenty of guys documenting 12,000 ft flights with Phantoms with stock motors/props

The Mavic has shown to be a high flyer as well.
The Mavic prop size is 8.3" with a 3" pitch (much smaller and SHALLOWER than Solo)
DJI states the Max service ceiling to be 16,404 feet!
Mavic- 1400 kv 3s Operating rpms (for purposes of discussion) are identical to Phantom or Solo

Higher altitudes are further documented by sputnik378 who states that he flies regularly at 14,000 feet WITH a (presumably stock motor/prop Solo)

Therefore, lower kv with large, high pitch props are NOT necessary for high altitude flights. And to state otherwise is simply not true.

 

[sputnik378]

I know exactly what dude was talking about however. The solo will not climb or move at all in fly or even manual. However put it in Stabilize and let her loose. Just don't crash. The first time I flew a new Solo this summer at higher elevation (11,500) I just wanted to take it easy and was in FLY mode. It didn't even get 100 feet away from me before I had to bring it home with low battery. It was flying super slow and blimpy. Threw in a second battery and took off in Stabilize mode and there she goes. 2000' away in no time at all, cruising at 11,850 no problem.

During the eclipse I drove to the top of one of the 14ers behind my house and flew around without any issue whatsoever. Slightly lower flight times maybe, but not huge. I am lucky to get 15 minutes per battery no matter what (landing with 25% or more) anyway.

I hope this answers some questions...

 

[Dobie Ardmore]

I know exactly what dude was talking about however. The solo will not climb or move at all in fly or even manual. However put it in Stabilize and let her loose. Just don't crash. The first time I flew a new Solo this summer at higher elevation (11,500) I just wanted to take it easy and was in FLY mode. It didn't even get 100 feet away from me before I had to bring it home with low battery. It was flying super slow and blimpy. Threw in a second battery and took off in Stabilize mode and there she goes. 2000' away in no time at all, cruising at 11,850 no problem.

During the eclipse I drove to the top of one of the 14ers behind my house and flew around without any issue whatsoever. Slightly lower flight times maybe, but not huge. I am lucky to get 15 minutes per battery no matter what (landing with 25% or more) anyway.

I hope this answers some questions...

Great to know. First hand, real world knowledge is the best and certain.

It seems strange that in FLY mode there would be a lack of power AND a low battery problem. I would say that some parameter in FLY mode is overriding the Fly mode and causing a dysfunction. Further, I would contend that the low battery warning was erroneous, and in fact, the battery still had plenty of juice left.

How could there be such a HUGE depletion of current in mere minutes? That makes no sense. For one, I don't think Solos' system would allow for that much current consumption (and why would there be?) and second I know that Solo's battery will not C out THAT much current in such a short period.

From what I see in eCalc, with AUW being 1.8kg, at 1000 feet, the thrust to weight ratio is 2.8; at 12000 ft it is 2; and at 15000ft it is 1.8; quite a difference but still flyable. How different did it handle at those higher altitudes?

I'm flying at 150asl and am also getting that same 15-18 minutes with 25% reserve. I am using MAS props (the factory props are to effing much $$) They seem sturdy and a bit less noisy. Hopefully they wont' be so sturdy as to not break away in a crash, causing instead, a bent motor shaft.

 

[Dobie Ardmore]

Hi I researched before I took my solo up to the tippy top of a 14er that I hiked so happened to be the highest peak in Colorado 14,433ft.

The highest I read about solo going was around 11k with 11" props from apc and there was someone who was going to test at 12k but never wrote his experience but with the upgraded antennas there are videos I've seen taking solo into the clouds.

So I decided to make the 12 mile hike with the added weight of solo stock props and 2 batteries plus all my normal gear. I thought it would fly as I've seen video of the little tiny mavic flying at 14k but I took my solo off hovered for a few seconds it dropped dramatically and I had a hard time keeping it in a small radius and hovering at the same altitude then it just began to descend until I took it down never got more than 20ft off the ground.

Is there anything I can do different or can solo just not handle the altitude? I figured it could cause I love this thing and thought the larger drone with larger motors could handle since the mavic could. Thanks!

I calculate that Solo WILL fly with equal performance at higher altitudes >12000ft with a 11" prop. Additionally, the prop pitch needs to be increased to 6". This combination will retain the thrust to weight ratio of 2.8.

This will raise the motor/esc temps even at 15000 ft though. Keep an eye/touch on them. Laser temp instruments are great. (I don't have absolute Solo motor specs, output, and current draw so take it on advisement that this prop will work without overheat.)It should be reasonably accurate))

Finding a prop that matches these parameters and fits the shaft may be a problem. I believe APC has one that will work with a minimum of adapting (not sure if the one I am thinking of is 6" though). However, a 11x4.7 will give you a 2.6 ratio at 12000ft, and 2.4 thrust to weight ratio at 15000ft with minimal heat. Those props are available and I understand will "sort of" fit. I will need to look for those model numbers specific to Solo's shaft.

Bear in mind though that this prop will most likely cause an overheat problem at lower altitudes<5000ft.

 

[sputnik378]

From what I see in eCalc, with AUW being 1.8kg, at 1000 feet, the thrust to weight ratio is 2.8; at 12000 ft it is 2; and at 15000ft it is 1.8; quite a difference but still flyable. How different did it handle at those higher altitudes?

I'm flying at 150asl and am also getting that same 15-18 minutes with 25% reserve. I am using MAS props (the factory props are to effing much $$) They seem sturdy and a bit less noisy. Hopefully they wont' be so sturdy as to not break away in a crash, causing instead, a bent motor shaft.

It doesn't fly much different. Not quite as punchy, but pretty consistent. I am going to fly tomorrow at near sea level, so I'll be able to give you a better idea after that. I've never flown below 7,000 feet before. I'm kind of excited to see the difference.

 

[Dobie Ardmore]

I calculate that Solo WILL fly with equal performance at higher altitudes >12000ft with a 11" prop. Additionally, the prop pitch needs to be increased to 6". This combination will retain the thrust to weight ratio of 2.8.

This will raise the motor/esc temps even at 15000 ft though. Keep an eye/touch on them. Laser temp instruments are great. (I don't have absolute Solo motor specs, output, and current draw so take it on advisement that this prop will work without overheat.)It should be reasonably accurate))

Finding a prop that matches these parameters and fits the shaft may be a problem. I believe APC has one that will work with a minimum of adapting (not sure if the one I am thinking of is 6" though). However, a 11x4.7 will give you a 2.6 ratio at 12000ft, and 2.4 thrust to weight ratio at 15000ft with minimal heat. Those props are available and I understand will "sort of" fit. I will need to look for those model numbers specific to Solo's shaft.

Bear in mind though that this prop will most likely cause an overheat problem at lower altitudes<5000ft.

Found it: Read this thread. It is quite informative!
https://3drpilots.com/threads/11-props-on-stock-solo-motors.6269/

 

[Dobie Ardmore]

I know exactly what dude was talking about however. The solo will not climb or move at all in fly or even manual. However put it in Stabilize and let her loose. Just don't crash. The first time I flew a new Solo this summer at higher elevation (11,500) I just wanted to take it easy and was in FLY mode. It didn't even get 100 feet away from me before I had to bring it home with low battery. It was flying super slow and blimpy. Threw in a second battery and took off in Stabilize mode and there she goes. 2000' away in no time at all, cruising at 11,850 no problem.

During the eclipse I drove to the top of one of the 14ers behind my house and flew around without any issue whatsoever. Slightly lower flight times maybe, but not huge. I am lucky to get 15 minutes per battery no matter what (landing with 25% or more) anyway.

I hope this answers some questions...

I am considering the possibility that in FLY mode Solo will NOT allow for a high altitude flight (perhaps even limiting to 400 ft) Therefore, Solo FLY will "take over" flight controller and descend (this may happen even if max altitude parameter is removed as per Solo's FLY mode coding)

Have you removed the Max altitude parameter?

 

[sputnik378]

I am considering the possibility that in FLY mode Solo will NOT allow for a high altitude flight (perhaps even limiting to 400 ft) Therefore, Solo FLY will "take over" flight controller and descend (this may happen even if max altitude parameter is removed as per Solo's FLY mode coding)

Have you removed the Max altitude parameter?

I have removed the max attitude parameter.

I was flying at 11,500 2 days ago in FLY mode and I had no problems at all. Flew 6 batteries, and chased a bunch of mountain bikers down the trail without any power issues whatsoever. I even flew up to 11,900 to get a wide shot of our position.

 

[Maddog]

Maybe we can convince them to make metallic silver colored ones? Then your props would be reflective for long distance flying? Put on two of those and two black ones and copter orientation becomes easier....

Not sure if this creates problems for other aviation, however....

I tried this with my Syma X8. I spray painted white props with different colors including red, metallic silver and metallic gold.
The props turn too fast to tell what color they are but I found out white is the most visable color at a distance.

 

[Maddog]

So I had some idea's in this area and wanted to know if it's one of those "good vs bad" idea's.

1: Solo is obviously a heat magnet on sunny days. In fact I'm weary of taking it up when it hits the high 90's, So wondering if wrapping the solo in a more reflective color would help keep it cooler. So a silver or white wrap. However.... the problem with this is when it gets up in the air, it may actually be harder to spot. So silver or white on top with a striped pattern underneath?

2: Although I like the idea of different colored props, I'm not sure the current colors are all that nice mix and match. Now, bright red props and silver props, I like that idea. Red on the rear I think would be easy to spot.

I thought the polar pro lights were a good idea, however there are drawbacks. I mean, you run the risk of blinding yourself looking at them... well, temporarily. The other is that when filming a drone with those lights (via another drone) the intensity of the light can actually blur your footage (so the drone you're filming tends to look a bit like a well lit up blob of light).

One more insane idea... Longer legs (replace wifi leg with a long omni directional antenna?) and color the darn legs! Not sure what it would do for the aerodynamics of the drone, but then again, it's not like it's a lifting body or anything. Winds might cause some stability issues is all I can think of.

Lets face it though, best thing to do (besides keep it in close view..) would be to put LED light strips on it that light individually (like turn signals on newer cars). So they light up from rear to front in a strobing fashion. Not only useful, but cool looking!

These work really well for seeing Solo at a distance and determining its' orientation, day or night. They also meet FAA requirements for night time anti-collision lighting. (Required for all night time flying including recreational)
https://3drpilots.com/threads/brite-lite-led-lighting-system.8863/
https://3drpilots.com/threads/brite-lite-anti-collision-lighting.11505/#post-119915