When to replace motors?

Ggirf14 · Feb 28, 2016

czrlaker said:
Why the heck wouldn't you make it simple to see the time on the motors.
/QUOTE]
What is your plan to prevent a crash ? Do you have in mind to just log the info after it crashed? If you have plenty of budget and fly 5 nautical miles from populated area and airports I would say why the heck. With the popularity of drones events will happen. Falling drone causing injuries or property damage and saying "not my fault my motors only had 100 hours and 3DR are saying to replace at 150". Such an answer will not fly with any government authorities and on the news.

AirCanada · Feb 28, 2016

OMG... i just had a huge popcorn thought! The industry I work in, I use an E8 Flir camera. Since heat is a big indicator of possible motor failure, there is no reason i can't use the E8 to record and see the heat signatures of the motors after use. I am going to get my Flir from work on Monday and do a few test to see. I also have an older AR 2.0 i use to practice with. I think I will try a few test with that one as well. I might be on to something here. Has anyone else thought about this?

RichWest · Feb 28, 2016

AirCanada said:
Has anyone else thought about this?

All day, every day... It's great to have such a tool at your disposal. Heat is the indicator for many electrical points of failure. Please post thermal pictures of everything around the bird; gimbal, motors, boards and battery. Heck even the GP...

AirCanada · Feb 28, 2016

will do. looking forward to this type of diagnostic testing. with the price drop of Flir for the lower end meters, it might be in the price range of the hobby-ist. you can get one that attaches to your Iphone for less than 500 bucks.

Ggirf14 · Feb 28, 2016

I like that kind of popcorn

bring it on AirCanada. Really you may be on to something. We really need inputs to know what' going on with the motors. Is there something (an app) that could provide us amps used for each motors. Dreaming a bit further a chime to warn the pilot of unusual amp consumption.
Would you feel comfortable driving your car knowing the temperature gauge is not working?

Mr GruntHunter · Apr 30, 2016

Using WD40 would absolutely be a no no, good for cleaning something but shouldn't be actually used as a lubricant. Applying oil is really not a long term solution as oil eventually drains off where as a grease will remain in place, which I suspect was used during the initial assembly. If you haven't run the motors for a period of time (unknown how long) then I would think it appropriate to apply a small amount of lubricant prior to flying. Not known how the motors are manufactured would tell me to stick with the manufactures recommendations (they should be telling us what to use, and how often). There are brass like materials that are impregnated with oil for areas that are difficult to get to or the usage environment dictates and the bearing races could be made from something like that. BTW; obtaining an infrared signature is an excellent approach and used in many preventative maintenance programs. We had an excellent PM program at the Kennedy Space Center and would inspect electrical breaker boxes, etc. with infrared cameras to detect bad internal connections and were able to prevent some very undesirable situations (launch scrubs come to mind). We would also analyze oil samples to determine pending maintenance requirements. Having a crawler break down with a Shuttle stacked on top of it on the way to the launch pad would have been a nightmare scenario to say the least (just some of the scenarios out of thousands).

Maddog · May 1, 2016

Mr GruntHunter said:
Using WD40 would absolutely be a no no, good for cleaning something but shouldn't be actually used as a lubricant. Applying oil is really not a long term solution as oil eventually drains off where as a grease will remain in place, which I suspect was used during the initial assembly. If you haven't run the motors for a period of time (unknown how long) then I would think it appropriate to apply a small amount of lubricant prior to flying. Not known how the motors are manufactured would tell me to stick with the manufactures recommendations (they should be telling us what to use, and how often). There are brass like materials that are impregnated with oil for areas that are difficult to get to or the usage environment dictates and the bearing races could be made from something like that. BTW; obtaining an infrared signature is an excellent approach and used in many preventative maintenance programs. We had an excellent PM program at the Kennedy Space Center and would inspect electrical breaker boxes, etc. with infrared cameras to detect bad internal connections and were able to prevent some very undesirable situations (launch scrubs come to mind). We would also analyze oil samples to determine pending maintenance requirements. Having a crawler break down with a Shuttle stacked on top of it on the way to the launch pad would have been a nightmare scenario to say the least (just some of the scenarios out of thousands).

Couldn't you just call AAA to come out & fix your 1,000,000 lb crawler?

Mr GruntHunter · May 1, 2016

Maddog said:
Couldn't you just call AAA to come out & fix your 1,000,000 lb crawler?

LOL ..... maybe with the right security clearance

Since AMF built it all of the bowling balls they used for bearing were replaced years ago

Actually Marion Power Shovel built them but I seem to remember that AMF did actually have something to do with them, maybe the control system.

Maddog · May 1, 2016

Mr GruntHunter said:
LOL ..... maybe with the right security clearance Since AMA built it all of the bowling balls they used for bearing were replaced years ago

Saw those beasts years ago on a tour. WOW- just WOW!

Mr GruntHunter · May 1, 2016

I retired 5 years ago after 35 years out there and now I'm looking into getting a drone to fly, by passing model rockets all together

Maddog · May 1, 2016

Mr GruntHunter said:
I retired 5 years ago after 35 years out there and now I'm looking into getting a drone to fly, by passing model rockets all together

Much easier & cheaper than your own space shuttle.

SurfnSkate81 · May 2, 2016

Maddog said:
Much easier & cheaper than your own space shuttle.

Although with all his experience I'd love to see his home made space shuttle!

Mr GruntHunter · May 2, 2016

Ha ha ha ....... Yeah, it's made out of 2x4's and plywood ! LOL I have quite a few photos posted on my Facebook page if you're interested (Facebook)

Jaycrossland30 · May 2, 2016

Maddog said:
I agree the T-motor swap is challenging & expensive. Having spare 3DR motors on hand is not a bad idea, but how do you know when one "might" be going bad? Listening to them doesn't strike me as reliable. (My Syma X8C has had a noisy motor since it was new but it is working fine- no hint of any problem).

How about vibration testing? Will a motor start throwing out bad vibrations before it dies? Who knows..

All I know is having unreliable motors in a flying machine that depends on ALL of them is unacceptable. But how many Solo's have been sold and how many motors have actually failed? Without that data we have no idea how reliable the motors actually are.

End of rant- we now return to our regular programming.

My solo came straight out of the box with a faulty motor no 3, and then all the other 3 props flew off on testing. How is this possible?

Maddog · May 4, 2016

Jaycrossland30 said:
My solo came straight out of the box with a faulty motor no 3, and then all the other 3 props flew off on testing. How is this possible?

Hi Jay - welcome to the forum.

There have been several reports of pod #3 failing in flight.
Maybe you had the props on the wrong motors?

Jaycrossland30 · May 4, 2016

Maddog said:
Hi Jay - welcome to the forum.

There have been several reports of pod #3 failing in flight.
Maybe you had the props on the wrong motors?

Maybe?, but I didn't think it was possible to put a black prop on a silver motor. I spoke to 3dr and they said this is possible due to a emergency stop by pressing a - b - plus fly. But I know I didn't pressure a and b.

Oh well my new one arrives tomorrow

Thanks

Ryanklingert · Jun 16, 2016

Thought it may be worth mentioning that I noticed that as of the 2.40 update today there is a way to view your flight time in the app.

JoelNewman · Jun 24, 2016

So has anyone come up with a data-driven way to diagnose a motor problem? (apart from thermal which is great if you happen to have a Flir on hand of course).

I have a motor that quite clearly stops before the others, and is tighter when spun by hand. Both Roland and I agree it's on it's way out, but it'd be awesome to find something in the telemetry or the logs to verify this.

The best I've come up with is plotting vibex/y/z during sequential motor tests in Misson Planner. A screenshot of the plot is attached which shows the vibrations caused by the first test of motor 1 (1902 - 1907 seconds) are much higher than the three following tests.

Maddog · Jun 24, 2016

JoelNewman said:
So has anyone come up with a data-driven way to diagnose a motor problem? (apart from thermal which is great if you happen to have a Flir on hand of course).

I have a motor that quite clearly stops before the others, and is tighter when spun by hand. Both Roland and I agree it's on it's way out, but it'd be awesome to find something in the telemetry or the logs to verify this.

The best I've come up with is plotting vibex/y/z during sequential motor tests in Misson Planner. A screenshot of the plot is attached which shows the vibrations caused by the first test of motor 1 (1902 - 1907 seconds) are much higher than the three following tests.

There are some motor balancing videos on YouTube where the guy uses some ubur-technical software to test the motors. Might be what your looking for. I'll try to find one when I can.

RichWest · Jun 24, 2016

The OP asked about replacing motor, but really it should be when to replace the bearings.

Joel I don't think vibration is a reasonable indicator for a failing motor or bearings for that fact. You'd have to have a benchmark reading to compare from the same motor when new. But even then you'd have to perform the test off the body to insure no further influences to slight further the test.

Amperage would be ideal, but again at the refresh rate and resolution from MP it would be questionable to see slight issues that would indicate failing motor or bearing. However I have never tried.

I've scoured the internet looking for the same answers as well. Like MD said there is techno equipment that could perform the testing, but at what expense for the hobbyist or small commercial user.

In the commercial realm, it will be important to have such a means to determine motor or bearing life. If they can't validate a maintenance program, then the industry is doomed. I'd imagine at present, chinese built motors have very little quality control once the motors are built.

The cogging I experienced from the 4 T-motors I received where fairly close, but one was odd. I'm keeping an eye on that motor and it also is the first to stop when I shut down the motors. Has nothing to do with bearings...in my opinion.

I think Roland would know the answer to this question. I find it odd he wouldn't have an answer. I think he is being a teacher.....