Welcome to 3DRPilots.com

Sign up and join the largest 3D Robotics drone community!

Introducing.. DJI Mavic. Karma Killer at $999!

Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by Jubalr, Sep 27, 2016.

  1. Jubalr

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2015
    Messages:
    2,647
    Likes Received:
    1,517
    Very interesting. And this is coming from someone that is not a fan of DJI as a company. Check out the video below. Karma Killer?



    If it goes down again,...Look for a 4:34 video here..
     
    #1 Jubalr, Sep 27, 2016
    Last edited: Sep 27, 2016
  2. EROC

    Joined:
    Sep 11, 2016
    Messages:
    57
    Likes Received:
    7
    Video is no longer available.
     
  3. Jubalr

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2015
    Messages:
    2,647
    Likes Received:
    1,517
    Fixed, not sure for how long..
     
  4. EROC

    Joined:
    Sep 11, 2016
    Messages:
    57
    Likes Received:
    7
    got it thanks
     
  5. Jubalr

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2015
    Messages:
    2,647
    Likes Received:
    1,517
    #5 Jubalr, Sep 27, 2016
    Last edited: Sep 27, 2016
  6. SteveReno

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2015
    Messages:
    1,669
    Likes Received:
    671
    Location:
    'Sparkling City by the Sea"
    Not too interested, but thanks for the News.
     
  7. thePeter

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2016
    Messages:
    16
    Likes Received:
    8
    This is miles ahead of anything on the market. I can't think of a reason to buy anything else instead - can anyone?
     
  8. twitchyzero

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2015
    Messages:
    425
    Likes Received:
    90
    if you're poor and already own a gopro or you're interested in more cinematic shots, buy a Solo for $399
    if you also like stabilized ground footage...Karma is compelling

    otherwise this probably destroys everything out there for its intended use given its advancements/ease of use/size.

    mods should merge the threads into the news section :)

    DJI Mavic
     
    EROC likes this.
  9. thePeter

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2016
    Messages:
    16
    Likes Received:
    8
    A $399 out-of-the-box Solo gets you nowhere fast. It cost me so much getting mine to a point where I'm (sort of) happy with it.
     
  10. User Name

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2015
    Messages:
    788
    Likes Received:
    521
    Interesting that you had a poor out-of-box experience with a $400 Solo, and yet are confidently suggesting a product which won't be shipping for another few weeks still beats everything else on the market. How do you know you won't have a poor out-of-box experience with the Mavic too?

    I'll admit that the stiff cables to the gimbal on the Solo cause issues, and replacing cables shouldn't be necessary, but for the minimal effort in doing so, I've been getting pretty darn good results from the Solo.

    I'm not hating on new products, from GoPro, DJI and others, but let's be honest - no one has had any hands-on time with anything that's not yet on the market, so making comparisons and judging winners betrays a bias that's not going to fly, no pun intended.
     
    franknitty69, EROC, SteveReno and 2 others like this.
  11. twitchyzero

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2015
    Messages:
    425
    Likes Received:
    90
    Remember when you called me out when I said Solos are going for $372? Barely a month ago.
    People have barely gotten to their $399 Solo yet. Some of us paid $1400 for it, most $1000, maybe $600 or 500 as additional ones for parts.

    Solo has nasty fisheye which means losing 4K resolution doing post or spending $200 on flat lens. Luckily I don't mind Solo's stock range but most drop another $150 there. That's just the tip of the iceberg for most of us. Filters, dampeners, but most importantly, tens and maybe hundred of hours figuring it all out. Not to mention months and months of downtime for hardware delays, RMA, software delays that comes out super buggy.

    GoPro Karma will also have fisheye concern and it's going to be a big question mark because they have minimal experience in this market.

    DJI has already proven itself with 5 iterations of Phantom, Inspire, octos, Osmo etc...if anyone can give the least trouble-free RTF solution, it's going to be the biggest player in the market. I'm just curious how well all these foldable drones will survive in a crash. Solo despite being plastic does fairly well...but that's not the weakest point...gimbal's usually done.
     
    #11 twitchyzero, Sep 27, 2016
    Last edited: Sep 27, 2016
  12. User Name

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2015
    Messages:
    788
    Likes Received:
    521
    Yes, I do. At the time, the only reason it was sold for the price you quoted was that B&H honored a mistake they made on their site. That sales have subsequently lowered the price to the same ballpark is irrelevant - at the time, it was a BS comment.

    What does that even mean? I bought 2 extras, and one is just sitting on a shelf for when I might need it. You could say I've "barely gotten to it yet", but how does that speak to anything in particular?

    And I'm one of them. $1500 and change for my first Solo, gimbal and extra battery - same as what I just paid $400 for. At the time, $1500 was a competitive price. Do I wish I paid less? Sure. Am I beating myself up for having done so? No, because no one would have thought prices would have dropped as much as they have.

    No, it doesn't, as Solo doesn't have a camera. The GoPro does, and always has, so if that was an issue for you, you shouldn't have chosen a drone that was built, specifically, to carry a GoPro. Don't like it, that's on you, not the Solo.

    But what does this have to do with someone claiming an unreleased product is better than a current one. My point was that it's impossible to say. You can have a bad out-of-box experience with any product, and it shows a bias when one complains about Solo in this respect and then immediately boasts about a product which NO ONE has seen in final shipping form.
     
    keads, franknitty69 and Tamj like this.
  13. SteveReno

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2015
    Messages:
    1,669
    Likes Received:
    671
    Location:
    'Sparkling City by the Sea"
    Are any of these new drones Open Source? Like Solo..
     
    Solo Keith likes this.
  14. twitchyzero

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2015
    Messages:
    425
    Likes Received:
    90
    One of the Pixhawk dev was flying Solo with a Sony Action Cam pre-release.

    Yep you're right, i dont like Hero products. But that's not why I bought Solo. I bought it for the smart shots. No quad is perfect and that's the sacrifice i chose because 3DR claimed prop/legs wont really be in the shot (which may be the case for medium settings, but not 4K which is what the competitors had.)

    One can make an educated guess that the Mavic will be significantly superior than Solo in many regards. Is it definitive? No. But judging from specs, unboxing and hands-on reviews you have a pretty good idea.

    It's like comparing a small company with minimal consumer experience to someone whos been in the business for a lot longer, much larger R&D and better track record. YA BUT DER CUSTOMER SUPPORT SAX, cried Solo fans. So has 3DR been great in that regards since spring? Which company stayed silent for 2 months at launch when gimbal was MIA?

    People dismissed Phantom 4's obstacle avoidance saying it was primitive. Solo's 3rd party option is what, $400-500? I can buy another Solo with that cash. and the official response from 3DR is AR/GF which never came for the majority of the users, Android owners.

    Not even 6 months later the Mavic has 4 sensors, a camera and 2 ultrasonic rangefinders and redundant IMUs. Can we expect it to be foolproof? No. But hell a lot better than what Solo owners can ever dream of having.

    tl;dr just take a step back. Pretend you didnt drop $2K on Solo/GoPro because that's ironically probably your biggest bias right now. Just a month or so ago you were in denial that the market value for Solo had already tanked below $600 and called me out for it when I was not wrong.

    Looking at it objectively, Solo may win in smart shots for consumers. That's pretty much it. The competition has already outpaced it on pretty much every other aspect.

    aside from Solex (which from what I hearing is fantastic...can't thank Kelly enough)
    how has that benefited consumers so far? A $400+ flow/lidar? How many of us are actually running that? a few owners at most?
     
    #14 twitchyzero, Sep 27, 2016
    Last edited: Sep 27, 2016
  15. pyrate

    Joined:
    May 4, 2015
    Messages:
    3,324
    Likes Received:
    1,259
    Location:
    Frisco Texas
    Yes it's made by DJI, couldn't give it to me
     
    SteveReno and Jubalr like this.
  16. User Name

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2015
    Messages:
    788
    Likes Received:
    521
    If one is basing their entire opinion on a spec sheet, one may indeed draw that conclusion. If one considers the ultimate goal of recording smooth cinematic shots, perhaps not. Personally, I'd take Solo's smart shots over all the collision avoidance available today. I can handle avoiding running into things perfectly fine for the type of flying I do. If I were interested in a lot of close in, weave through trees type of shots, I'd probably feel different, but that's not my interest when it comes to capturing images.

    Since you're bringing up a timeline, you might also want to consider that the Solo was released in May of 2015. Mavic will be released almost a full year and a half after Solo. Technology is progressing at a rapid pace. That sensors galore have become the standard in the past year and a half isn't a knock against the Solo, since nothing but high-end, custom built platforms had that when Solo was released.

    I have no bias. The Mavic looks great, I love that the gimbal/camera is enclosed in a little bubble shielding it from wind/turbulence. I love how small it is. I love that it has all those sensors, and I love that it will reportedly have impressive flight times. I love the Karma, I love how small it is, I love the big screen that's integrated into the controller, I love how the gimbal is detachable for handheld work. But none of that makes me hate the Solo. At the time I bought my first Solo, for $1500, I considered it reasonably priced against the competition and offered features and capabilities that even higher priced competition lacked. Things have changed, and I wouldn't pay $1500 or even $600 for a Solo today. But at the recent sale prices, it's still a terrific product.

    If not instantly hating a 1.5 year old product I own just because something new comes out makes me biased, I'm sorry, we simply have different definitions of what constitutes bias. Your continual bashing of the Solo for supposed shortcomings you were aware of GOING IN is much more indicative of bias (a negative bias) in my book.

    I'm sorry facts mean nothing to you. And just like you faulting the Solo for what has come out 1.5 years later, you attempt to validate your BS claim based on events that have happened since. People see right through it, so just stop.

    How many? Very few. So what's your point? Again, that a product released a year and a half after Solo will have it? So what? I wouldn't add it to my Solo even if it was more readily available because it's benefit would be outweighed by the hit in flight times because of the weight of the setup.

    My next non-Solo quad (I'm not ruling out a 4th if the sale prices continue), will have all those bells and whistles you're so enamored with, but I still won't hate the Solo. If others surpass the Solo in automated smart shots, great, I'll repurpose my Solo's for mapping or carrying lights or something.

    And I think I've spent far more time than I should responding to you about all this, so on the ignore list you go. Have a nice life, enjoy your Mavic or Karma or whatever else you buy. Just promise me you'll hate it as much as you hate the Solo as soon as something better comes out. If not, you're the one who's biased.
     
    #16 User Name, Sep 27, 2016
    Last edited: Sep 27, 2016
  17. SteveReno

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2015
    Messages:
    1,669
    Likes Received:
    671
    Location:
    'Sparkling City by the Sea"
    Don't mean to disrespect anyone,

    I Like 3DR Solo's.
    I like Mopar Have a 70 Hemi Cuda
    I like european women " Married me one" .

    I hear there are better tech. Dones available now,
    I remember Ford owners telling me I need a Boss 429 CJ Mustang
    i think Marilyn Monroe was Gorgeous.

    My Solo has features that no other Drone has, it's mostly Open Source & It's got Smart Shots!
    My Cuda can still make someone wish they had extra pants when they ask for a ride!
    There's not another woman that can light me up, the way my love does. We were married in 1970.

    I'm trying to say "to each, his own" For if the world was as good looking & smart like me, this world would be a boring place LOL

    I'm a happy puppy.
     
    Jubalr and Crisp Rice like this.
  18. twitchyzero

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2015
    Messages:
    425
    Likes Received:
    90
    Without a gimbal, Solo couldn't even do what it was meant for until September last year, so we're only really a year of difference in tech.

    Did you forget that Solo was meant to be a growing platform? That's how 3DR fanboys defended the platform and it's not an inferior product a year later because you can throw things onto the accessory bay and it can accomodate a new gopro (look how that turned out).

    Never owned DJI and dislike goPro, yet it's 3DR that I'm criticizing. I have no brand loyalty. I buy what suits my needs and what gives the best performance. DJI might have what I need. Too early to say for sure.

    Sorry to see that you got real salty & bitter wishing others hate what they spend hard-earned money on. Traits of those who are in denial i guess.

    I have no words for you if you just tried to compare quadcopters to women.

    One can be timeless and subjective.
    Automobiles has not been innovative in decades.
    Quadcopters are advancing as fast as phones (we're talking 6 month intervals).

    apples to oranges to bricks.

    thanks for the effort though.
     
    #18 twitchyzero, Sep 27, 2016
    Last edited: Sep 27, 2016
  19. DattaGroover

    Joined:
    May 8, 2015
    Messages:
    546
    Likes Received:
    102
    Location:
    Fort Collins, Colorado
    Here are my doubts:
    1) How will this do in wind compared to a heavier drone, like the Solo?
    2) How easily will the little bubble around the gimbal (and camera) get dirty, fogged, or scratched? How will light bouncing around the inside of that little dome mess up the shot? I have high-end Canon lenses that I shoot naked (no filter) for that reason. Even a $175 filter can cost you shots, what to speak of a semi-spherical plastic bubble.
    3) How does the Mavic camera REALLY compare with a GoPro with a 3.97mm lens? Both for video and stills. It's not hard to make video look good for a demo. What is it like in real life? I have seen a lot of comparison footage with the Phantom 4 vs GoPro. The GoPro seems much better to my eyes, but the way DJI hypes it, many people miss that, and are convinced the P4 has as good or better camera. How well does the gimbal stabilize? It's concept vs. application.
    4) How well do all the things they are bragging about really work? Ideas (and even specs) are one thing, practical application (and visuals) may be something else. Does this have big bugs like the Phantom 2 had (with its GPS and freak-out issues)?

    That said, I love the size, flight time, etc. It's got a great bunch of concepts crammed into this design. I'm fine waiting to see how the above points get answered. AND, it means a direction for drone designs, I think.

    If I was starting over, today, I'd still get one of those Solos for $400. Ask me again in 6 months, and I might have a different perspective. But I might not, either. ;)
     
    RichWest likes this.
  20. twitchyzero

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2015
    Messages:
    425
    Likes Received:
    90
    it's just a gimbal protector...optional for flights.

    Hero4 black with 3.97mm + lens profile is a $700 item...almost as much as the Mavic bird itself.

    but if you want to compare on spec sheet alone it'll be inferior since Mavic is capable of shooting in DCI 4K, not just 4K UHD.